That is soooo cool.
Dont worry about the Dutch thing.
U would be suprised at those who are Dutch born Kiwis, Sth African Kiwis, and Those from Sth Africa also.
Its just us Kiwis who cant actually read it...but Christmas has its own universal langauge, so that doesnt matter either
All the best to you and your family also.
Edit:
I have been thinking about doing something to the site for Christmas.
I have no idea on graphics.
A banner would be nice 840x 144 to 150 height
Along the lines of your Kike Christmas Pic would be really cool.
Could we impose on u to make one please? _________________ My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 9:11 am Post subject: chrismas - card
South africa..... we can understand each other, since the language looks very much like the dutch language.
That is far away , how is the weather there, it s freezing here but the kakariki s dont mind they are still in the outside aviary.
They go to the frost -protected part themselves when it gets dark.
They dont mind all the flickring christmas lights we have in the backyard,
many greetings,
MARIANNE _________________ HUGS,
Marianne
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:17 am Post subject: Banner for Steptoe
Is this what you are looking for ( I am a beginner in psp so I cannot make moving =animated banner)
I got the pictures from your own map, hope you like it.
17 Degrees Celcius here in Cape Town and thats the lowest night time temperature. Usually hits around 30 degrees most days now sometimes 35. Last summers high was around 40. My biggest concern is for my kakariki babies in the nest when it gets so hot. The adults moult quite heavily in summer and look scruffy. Our winters are mild and the kakarikis seem to enjoy it. 5 degrees is a cold winters night, average is around 10 degrees, ocasinally drops to zero and we have a little frost. They breed right through winter and I usually try to stop pairs from breeding after three consecutive clutches for about six months.
Afrikaans is not my first language but most white South Africans educated while the previous apartheid government were in charge of education are bilingual and quite fluent in Afrikaans. We used to have two official languages (English and Afrikaans) now we have eleven official languages but English is the most dominant / practical.
Afrikaans is mainly of Dutch origin with French, German and English influences. The largest Afrikaner church (Dutch Reformed) still used a Dutch bible until around about the 1930's. Anyway enough history.
Marianne, I see you have a lutino and a normal kakariki. How prevelant (common) are the lutino's in the Netherlands and what is the price difference between the normal and the Lutino. I belive that the lutino mutation was first established in Europe. I know that the Lutino stock we have here has origins in Belgium. Lutino's are still fairly rare here.
Is jy 100% gemaklik met Engels of sukkel jy 'n bietjie?
Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:57 pm Post subject: re temp. and sout africa
o dear it is getting very cold here, this night at about below 10 degrees Celsius, but it will be a little warmer the next days.
We might have a white cristmas ......
The lutino kakariki is most expensive here, but not rare, the yellow frontheads are protected by the law and you need CITES for them, so you dont see them very often.
(please correct me if I am wrong, there must be an other dutch member here)
My favorite is the pied,(yelllow and green,) maybe because my tame kakariki has got this colour.
So the cinamons , wildcolour, lutinos and pied(yellow/greens) are most seen here.
It s a very long time that I was at school and had english lessons, I also speak french and german, because we we obliged to learn these languages and I never regret is that I have learned them.
many greetings,
MARIANNE _________________ HUGS,
Marianne
Mariannenl
If u right clk the banner at the top, clk save target as, u can save to your desktop.
The decorate, have a play, u may loose the animation thats OK, then post it back.
I don't even have graphics except ACDSee
Quote:
o dear it is getting very cold here, this night at about below 10 degrees Celsius, but it will be a little warmer the next days.
We might have a white Christmas ......
We are having one of the wettest . coldest summers I rem in 50 odd yrs!!!
(On the weather thing at the side u can get the forecast and map for your town/and part of the world)
Quote:
CITES for them, so you don't see them very often.
(please correct me if I am wrong, there must be an other dutch member here)
Permits... written Government permission? A guess.
Quote:
It s a very long time that I was at school and had English lessons, I also speak French and German, because we we obliged to learn these languages and I never regret is that I have learnt them.
I envy multi lingual ppl..we don't get those opertunities here, other than Maori.
I have enough problems getting my head around programing language, let alone learning something other than English. I think its good u guys being able to converse in a common language. I like the international flavour it gives the site.
Can u use the translation flags on the front right lower page, then type in your native language and post? I don't know how or if it works.
I think if u are logged in, and set the language u want it stays like that, for next time u log in. In designing the site my intention was to put 'user friendly' first.
Also , on the quick search u can translate the whole site, choose your translation then hit the go.
Cheers. _________________ My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'
I tried the German translation as I have at least a tiny understanding of German having had one year of German at school. The translation is very effective, 99% of words are translated, my German is too poor to comment on the grammar however. Unusual words like handrearing are not translated and are left in English. I tried to post a reply via the translation but got sent back to google.
Pity there are only five languages and no Dutch
There is a great looking French language Kakariki site, his contact email is kakariki@free.fr and the site address is: http://kakariki.free.fr/0essaicibleindex.htm. Steptoe, perhaps you could let him know how to translate his site into English as it looks like there are quite a few articles there that should be of interest.
Translations are limited to what google has avalible and the base port design of this site...my coding is VERY limited and can only be described as 'hit 'n miss' ..no I m not being modest, its true.
The only thing I know how to do in Front page is find the help file...honest!!
Anyone who thinks this site or wishes to refer us onto anther site is very to do so. The main function of the community here and site is to freindship and co operation, help out...not just Kikes.
Swaping of links etc, ( i have member web pages in the links section) u have a computer problem, garden, restoring classic cars, we would like to hear in the general section of the forums.
What are our members into other than Kikes?
So who has finished their Christmas shopping? We finished ours last night. _________________ My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'
Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2004 11:47 am Post subject: for Steptoo and others, this is what I mean with CITES :
I copied this from the website of the dutch parrot refuge, it s a long article which explains what I mean with CITES , it s a law to protect rare bird breeds, here it is :
More and more animal and plant species are being threatened with extinction. And there are two important causes:
The destruction of the habitat of these species.
Forests are cut down at a rapid tempo for the harvest of wood or to be replaced by farming-land.
The lively international trade in endangered exotic plant and animal species.
Often this concerns animals that don't live in the wild in the Netherlands: exotic animals.
In earlier days many such animals were caught in the wild and brought to the Netherlands to be kept as pets or in zoos, until it was discovered that some of these species could hardly be found in the wild any more and were threatened with extinction.
The illegal trade in animals, plants and natural products manifests itself in several ways: from the ignorant tourist who brings an ivory statuette as a souvenir to the trader who imports a shipment of three hundred chameleons into the Netherlands.
To put a stop to the excessive exploitation of endangered species an international treaty was concluded in 1973 in Washington: CITES.
The notation CITES is the abbreviation of the English name of the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of wild fauna and flora.
Already 143 countries have signed this treaty, committing themselves to stand by the agreements that they signed. The Netherlands is State Party at CITES since July 18th, 1984.
Important agreements:
No animals are to be caught from the wild to be exported if the species is being threatened with extinction by international trade. Examples are: whales and dolphins, the elephant, rhinoceros, several monkey species, tigers, many parrot species, turtle-and lizard species. These species are included in Appendix I of CITES.
Many animal species are only to be exported if a CITES-permit has been granted. They include for instance beasts of prey and crocodile species, all giant snakes, a number of shell species and many coral species. A permit will only be granted if only a small number of animals of one species are to be exported. Researchers constantly review whether a permit should be granted or not. One of the main factors is that enough male and female members of a species should be left behind, to ensure that enough young ones are born into the wild. As soon as the size of the population of a group of wild animals becomes reduced because too many are being caught, the joined countries can decide that in a certain country these animals won't be taken from the wild any longer. These species are included in Appendix II of CITES.
CITES also has an Appendix III. Here species are included of which the country that is their original habitat, finds it important that the export is monitored and asks other countries for their help.
Only those species, in which trade traffic between countries is high can be protected by CITES. This means that many exotic animal species are not included in CITES (for instance scorpions, most rattlesnakes, sharks). CITES for one can not protect the areas in which these animals live.
Every two years researchers and other experts of those countries that signed the treaty, get together. They go over the agreements to check if there are countries that are not standing by the treaty and can include species that need protection in the appendixes.
Because of the system where permits are needed, it is possible to monitor how many animals are taken from the wild. When a country exports too many animals of one species, a decision can be made to (temporarily) prohibit the import of these animals. Sometimes it is necessary to determine how many of these animals are still living in the wild within the borders of such a country and to come to an agreement about how many animals can be exported. This is called an export-quota. The export-permit of such a country has to state exactly how many animals of that particular species have been exported in a certain year.
Sometimes it is necessary to completely prohibit the international trade in such a species. They will then be included in Appendix I of CITES.
Appendixes:
Because endangered species have been put on Appendixes, international trade will only be possible when a document has been issued: a CITES-import or export permit, a CITES-re-export certificate or a certificate of origin.
Appendix I
includes species that are threatened with extinction by international trade among others. Trade in these species is prohibited when it concerns animals or plants living in the wild.
Appendix II
includes species that might be endangered by international trade among others. Therefore this trade is being regulated.
Appendix III
includes species to which the country in which they live, wants to give protection in order to prevent them from becoming extinct in that particular country because of international trade.
The trade in CITES-species is regulated through this system of permits.
CITES in the European Union
The European Union (EU) has drawn up rules about the trade in CITES-species, that will apply to all those countries which are members of the EU. These rules are included in Regulations (nos. 939/97, 338/97 and 2307/97). Regulation (EG) 2307/97 contains the Appendixes A through D. Here species are included, on which certain rules are in force.
The Appendix I species of CITES and a few Appendix II species are included in Appendix A of this regulation.
Also included are species that are subject to strict protection in Europe on the ground of European guide-lines. They don't necessarily have to be CITES-species.
The Appendix II species of CITES are mostly included in Appendix B.
The Appendix III species of Cites are mostly included in Appendix C.
Appendix D includes non-Cites-species of which the European countries feel that trade in these species should be monitored to prevent them from becoming endangered because of international trade.
Sometimes the European guide-lines are even more strict than CITES. According to CITES an importer only needs an import permit if it concerns species of Appendix I. The European basis regulation forces an importer to be in possession of an import permit-or certificate for all CITES-species.
CITES in the Netherlands
In the Netherlands the Ministry of Agriculture, Nature-management and Fishing-industry (LNV) plays an important role in the implementation of the CITES treaty. The department has a special CITES-office. Its task is to convert the international agreements into national policy. The CITES-office is also engaged in granting dispensations and permits. Every year the office reports to the world-wide CITES-secretariat, which resides in Geneva.
The CITES-office grants permits for import and export of endangered animals. Sometimes the CITES-office consults with researchers in considering whether a permit can be granted. These researchers are members of a Committee, the CITES-committee. They meet about six times per year to discuss the trade in endangered animals (and plants).
Regulations concerning this trade have been laid down by law: the endangered species of wild fauna and flora Law.
Animals which were bred in the Netherlands:
Animals were and are imported into the Netherlands with a CITES-import permit. Sometimes these animals were taken from the wild. This is only permitted if strict conditions were met.
It is often difficult to provide proper care for animals that have been taken from the wild. Often these animals can't habituate to living in captivity, especially if they don't receive specialist care.
Fortunately a lot of imported animals do not come from the wild, but were bred in captivity.
In the Netherlands a lot of parrots and snakes are bred for trade as well as for hobby.
Such animals born in captivity are often easier to keep and they are more comfortable with this life than if they had been caught from the wild. After all they don't know any better. For this reason and because keeping these kinds of animals is not at the expense of wildlife, the law is less strict about the keeping, buying and selling of in captivity born animals.
In the Netherlands it is not allowed to keep monkeys and many beasts of prey as pets, not even when they are born in captivity.
In the Netherlands the Common Inspection Services (A.I.D.), the police and customs-officers (both import and export) can check if animals were born in captivity or were taken from the wild. They also check if a Cites-permit for import was issued. People who keep or sell such animals have to show how they obtained these animals and if it is required by law produce valid legal papers (a permit or a dispensation).
In case the animals are kept or sold not in accordance with the law, this means illegal, the animals can be seized. They will be placed in the care of a zoo or a specialized refugee centre (such as the Foundation Dutch Parrot Refugee in Veldhoven). The judge can impose a punishment for breaking the law, a fine or prison sentence or both.
The Budep Law
In the Netherlands this agreement and the Cites treaty of the European Union is carried out by means of the law on endangered species of wild fauna and flora (Budep).
On some points the Dutch legislation goes even further than the European legislation. A big change, in comparison with the previous Bud Law, is that it is prohibited to own a great number of Cites-species. In addition to this the burden of proof rests with the owner. A person who is in possession of Cites-species has to be able to prove that the plants or animals concerned were obtained legally or that they were bred or grown in the Netherlands.
Taking specimens of the indicated species and parts and/or products from that species into or out of Dutch territory is only permitted if the Budep Law grants a dispensation, usually by means of a Cites import or export permit, a re-exportation certificate or a certificate for trade within the European Union. On the grounds of the exemption rule included in the law such a dispensation may not always be necessary.
The legislation concerning possession of and trade in the above-mentioned specimens within the Netherlands is also included in the Budep Law.
Purpose:
On August 1st 1995 the law on endangered species of wild flora and fauna (Budep) came into operation so that the illegal trade could be better handled. With this the shortcomings of previous legislations have been solved and penalties have increased.
The purpose of the legislation is not to prohibit all trade in endangered exotic species, but to regulate this trade better. The Budep Law contains possession and trade bans for species covered by the Cites treaty. The prohibition orders are more strict accordingly dependant upon the threat the species' are under. Import and export is regulated by a system of dispensations, certificates, dispensations and permits.
Practice:
The Netherlands has some important areas of distribution for exotic fauna and flora species. The biggest market is that of individual consumers. They can be people looking for an exclusive pet, tourists returning from a trip to an exotic place and bringing home a souvenir, but also collectors or breeders with a special liking for certain species. This last group especially of people is often looking for exclusive animals or plants, has special knowledge and is prepared to invest a lot of money in its hobby.
Foreign plants and animals enter our country in three different ways. Two locations deserve special attention: Schiphol airport and Rotterdam harbour. A lot of shipments containing live animals enter the Netherlands via Schiphol. And the big stream of tourists who spend their holidays far from home arrive at Schiphol.
Most of the Cites-goods that are seized by Customs are souvenirs. Goods like choral, products made out of ivory, wholesome plasters containing animal products, belts and handbags made of crocodile leather, but also larger souvenirs like baptismal font-shells are seized. Rotterdam harbour receives many commercial shipments with merchandise containing animal or plant products. Often cargos containing plants arrive by ship. Transport by ship is less suited for living animals.
Not seldom, illegal shipments enter the Netherlands by road. Such shipments may have entered Europe through a foreign airport, with the intention to avoid Schiphols inspection. Zoos play a minor part in the international trade. They often have their own breeding-program. Zoos make mutual agreements about the exchange of species.
Content:
Prohibitions
Two of the most important articles of the Budep Law are articles 3 and 3a. Article 3 contains an unconditional ban on possession, trade, import and export of species included in Appendix I of Cites, on list C1 of the EG-legislation and the Flora and fauna habitats guide-lines of the European Union. On grounds of article 4 of the Budep Law the Netherlands have appointed species, for which the ban mentioned in article 3 is operative as well.
Conditional prohibitions
For species which are covered by Cites and the EG-legislation, but have not been included in article 3, is a conditional ban on possession, trade, import and export in force. This ban is laid down in article 3a of the Budep Law. There are a few exceptions. The ban on possession and trade does not apply to those who can prove that their animals were bred in the Netherlands. It also applies to all grown plants, covered by article 3a. The exception also goes if the plants and animals in question entered the Netherlands in accordance with the Budep Law or if the owner obtained them legally at a time when they were not yet pointed out as protected species. Nota bene: These exceptions do not apply for the import and export ban. For import and export a dispensation is needed.
Dispensations
Article 5 regulates dispensations of the rules in articles 3 and 3a. The separate cases are laid down in a dispensations-legislation. There is not a ban on possession, transport and trade for many birds that were bred in captivity, provided that they are fitted with a ring. But it is still prohibited to import or export these birds without a dispensation.
A different kind of dispensation is the one for antiques. Objects that are clearly antique or worked on 50 years ago are not subject to the ban on possession, transport or trade. But import from outside the EU into the Netherlands is still prohibited, just like export to a country that is not a member of the EU.
Then there are dispensations for some animal species, like the harp seal, the hooded seal, the chinchilla, the yak and some land tortoises. The dispensation also applies for all demonstrable cultivated plants covered by article 3 and 3a.e
For species which are not subject to dispensations, exemption of the prohibition rules as mentioned in article 3 and 3a can be granted by the minister. Such an exemption has to be applied for in advance at the Cites office of the Department of LNV.
And then there is the dispensation according to article 12 of the Budep Law. The ban on possession and transport of certain species does not apply if the owner can make it plausible that he already owned the specific plants or animals before the Bud Law or the Budep Law became operative. All other bans remain in force.
Administration:
Article 6 dictates that everyone who handles plant and animal species covered by the Budep Law in a commercial way, needs to keep regulation records. This rule, in force since January 1st 1996, is an important aid in monitoring the observance of the law. The article can be seen in a broad view: non-commercial individuals who sell or exchange will have to keep records as well.
Import, export and transit; which papers are required?
Import into the Netherlands
To be granted dispensation for importing plants or animals covered by the Budep Law and originating from outside the EU, an import permit or certificate is needed. Usually the Cites office does not grant dispensations for commercial purposes, unless it concerns specimens bred or grown in captivity. Each dispensation is only valid for one shipment and validity will expire after six months. For imported animals or plants from other EU-countries a EU-certificate is needed.
Transit to EU-country
Transit via the Netherlands of exotic animals and plants to an EU-country is permitted. But there are a few conditions attached. The country which exports the shipment can not reserve any rights to the specific species. And it needs to be monitored if the EU did not set up an import ban for the species in question.
The shipment has to be accompanied by a valid export document. Customs officers can settle the import formalities in the Netherlands, but this can also be done in the EU-country of destination. In the future this will most likely change. The import formalities must be dealt with in the 1st EU-country in which the shipment arrives, as soon as the EU basic legislation becomes operative. At Dutch Customs the importer will have to show the original import permit as well as the original export documents.
Transit to third world country
Transit via the Netherlands to a country which is not a member of the EU is in principle permitted. The transporter will have to show a valid export document and the exporting country can not reserve any rights to the specific species.
Export from the Netherlands
Dispensation of the export ban is needed if it concerns species appointed on grounds of articles 3 and 3a of the Budep Law. Such a dispensation is usually drawn up on an export permit, the re-exportation certificate or, if it concerns cultivated plants, the cultivation certificate. Export permits are only granted for cultivated plants, demonstrable in captivity bred animals, recognizable parts or products of these plants or animals.
The export formalities must be handled by Customs of the country from which the plants or animals leave the EU. The exporter will have to show: the original export permit, if desired re-exportation papers or (if it concerns plants) a certificate of health. In case the destination is an EU-country a EU-certificate is required.
Transit from EU-country
If it concerns living plants or animals then the export documents must be issued in the same country that the shipment was at the time the owner applied for the permit. The formalities are handled by Dutch Customs. They will require the original export document.
Upholding the law:
The inspection and criminal preservation of the Budep Law is a task of the Common Inspection Service (AID), the police, Customs and the Royal Military Police. In case officers need specialist aid they can call on the national team of nature protection of the AID, a group of fourteen specialists who are on stand-by around the clock to lend a helping hand.
Since 1994 OM, AID, police and customs have joined forces in the CITES project. The project aims at driving back the international illegal trade in endangered fauna and flora species into or out of the Netherlands. Tracing and mapping out the trade is most important. Intensive criminal investigations need to be reported at the secretariat of the Cites-project relegated to the Division CRI of the Corps National Police forces.
Penalty:
The Budep law is mentioned in article 1a of the Law on economic offences. A person who deliberately breaks the regulations mentioned in the Budep Law, commits a crime. The maximum penalty is six years imprisonment and/or a fine of ƒ100.000 for individuals. For corporate bodies the maximum fine is ƒ1.000.000. If a crime was committed unintentionally the maximum penalty is one year imprisonment and/or a fine of ƒ25.000 for individuals, ƒ100.000 for corporate bodies. _________________ HUGS,
Marianne
Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2004 11:49 am Post subject: for Steptoo
I am sorry for you but I tried to make a christmas banner for the site, the one a few articles higher in this forum was a little easier to make,( did your see iit, your birds are on it) but I did not succeed in making one with the Club Banner , helas.
I got your message on my hotmail account ( it s an extra payed for account of 2.000Kbs) and dont understand the problem , because I get a message when someone has posted an answer or when you post a message to my account ( much better than a month or longer ago, that was really in html,) but now I can read them all. _________________ HUGS,
Marianne
[
There is a great looking French language Kakariki site, his contact email is kakariki@free.fr and the site address is: http://kakariki.free.fr/0essaicible/index.htm. Steptoe, perhaps you could let him know how to translate his site into English as it looks like there are quite a few articles there that should be of interest.[/quote]
this link is not working, it should be , I changed it in the quote, and if it does not work just try :
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to do so. The main function of the community here and site is to freindship and co operation, help out...not just Kikes.
