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Kakariki, Care, Breeding, Ecology, and Conservation :: View topic - cuttlefish bone
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cuttlefish bone
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ksue
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 5:10 pm    Post subject: cuttlefish bone

How much does everyones birds use the cuttlefish?? my bird has never touched it and now that we have the cockatiel in there as well I have noticed that astrix (the cockatiel) all over it (2-3 times aday). Is it very bad that toby (kakariki) wont touch it, he eats the grit and sand that i have in there not much but he does.... so question is ....is this very bad for him I assume if he needed it he would eat it but he never has???????
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:46 pm    Post subject:

ALWAYS have cuttle fish avalible...yes it lasts for ages in our flights, I think that maybe because of chop/chicken bones, and/or because we use pumice sand on the floors. Maybe females get into cuttle fish more than males because of laying...I dont really know, just guessing, regardless have it there, if they need it they have got it.
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Kaka-riki
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 9:07 pm    Post subject:

We supply cuttlefish but it seldom gets touched. There is a calcium supplement available that the Kakariki go crazy for. It is crushed egg shells, cuttlefish and shell and is laced with aniseed. If you want to try it out send me a PM and I will give you the details.
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ksue
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 10:40 am    Post subject:

Oh yeah I always have it in there....just since I got the cockatiel and he uses it daily I have started to think "I hope toby isnt doing damage" but the cockatiel is still young so maybe he needs it more he also eats more of the grit sand mix but toby does regularly have a go of that too he seems to actually prefure the sand mix than the actual shell grit I have been mixing them together half half in the one dish but I think I might start putting one of each in....what do you think??
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Kaka
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 3:12 pm    Post subject: Message for Kaka-riki. RE: Calcium suppliment

emb

Wasn't sure if the PM I sent you had worked so just making sure and asking you via the forum. Sorry. Am new to site and still finding my way round :o)
Could you give me the information on the calcium suppliment you mentioned that Kakarikis go nuts for? Have been looking for this kind of thin for ages!!
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Kaka-riki
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 5:48 pm    Post subject:

Kaka,
I did recieve your PM and have replied. Hope the info helps.
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Allen
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:44 pm    Post subject:

A calcium supplement is a better way to go. The fact that your bird is ignoring the cuttle fish is probably good, it means he is not deficient (craving) anything and that he is not bored.

I used to use cuttle fish for my birds but they only really paid them any attention when eggs were being laid. Since I have started using a calcium supplement with there soft food, the cuttlefish is almost totally ignored.
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 7:19 am    Post subject:

Not all calcium is equal...
Ca come is many forms, each form with its own use.

Chalk,
cement, concrete (diff form to cement)
egg shell, cooked egg shell (heat changes structure)
Pumice,
bones,
Cuttle fish
Shell fish.

Birds/animals require several forms to be of use, many forms are useless

We use, cuttle fish, pumice sand, bones. (sun dried sheep/goat skull, whole)
Plus a racing pigeon mineral supplement.
We do not give shop bird grit or have it added to our Seed mix.

Yrs ago we kept hens for laying, and giving our young children some thing 'real' to be responsible for. (we live in the city) We recycled the cooked egg shells and ran into problems of Ca defiency....
This was quickly sorted with crushed ,sun bleached pacific oyster shell (uncooked) and pumice sand, cooked chop, chicken bones and sun-dried bones from the butcher.

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Allen
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 10:30 pm    Post subject:

We used to do things like that 20 years ago.

I think that avicultural products are more advanced in certain parts of the world than in others. Here we have supplements specifically developed by avian specialists for parrot species. A number of our local products are exported to the UK and Australia.

The days of using pidgeon grit, supplements, medicines etc. are over.
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:46 am    Post subject:

I'm not a fan of commercial foods, unless we can not supply those nutrients via fresh natural means
Quote:
Here we have supplements specifically developed by avian specialists for parrot species

The difference with Kakariki is They are unique in many of their feeding habits
Much of our land is 'new' and volcanic
Iodine is lacking in our foods
Cobalt was lacking in large areas
No native mammals or snakes hence the kakapo is flightless and kakariki feed much of the time on the ground, digging and foraging for grubs and seeds. Hence posts concerned about long claws on kakariki, needed for scratching on the forest floor. Also (including Kakariki) of many of our birds nesting in burrows dug in the ground.
We have a very large coast line and waterway edges in proportion to land mass.
We don't have larger edible fruits like mangoes, apples, citrus.
We don't have nuts similar to walnut, almonds
We don't have ANY similar grasses or flowers that are found in any commercial seed mix. Sunflower, wheat, barley, millet
A classic examples of uniqueness
up to the 1920s Gouter in ppl was a major heath problem till iodine was added by law to table salt..solved the problem...Now the Gov in it wiseness of PC policies has removed this legislation and goutier is now becoming a heath problem.
Clover was introduced 3 times by early settlers to add nitrogen to the soils. Failed each time then they introduced the bubble bee to fertilised the clover. Even the common bee was introduced.
Birds where reasonable for most fertilisation of plants, now with the introduction of other insects these actually compete with our birds for food, causing conservation problems.
Most of our native wild life have no inherent fear of man, hence extinction and near extinct of so many species from the moa to kakariki.
The majority of our native plants only have White and Blue coloured flowers with very few exceptions.
Our waterways only have several (now endangered) fish species including eel, but no carp, minnows etc.

Due to the uniqueness of the NZ flora/fauna and land type, also because of the lack of natural study of feeding of Kakariki there are no chimerical, supplements for Kakariki.
There is a research paper in the downloads section...keep in mind this study was done on a populated (ppl) island,in the very early process of regeneration, on small flocks.

We have 2 poisonous plants, poropro and tutu...these can kill cattle. Yet these are needed for Kakapo parrots to become fertile and breed.

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Cattscapes
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Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:35 pm    Post subject: cuttlefish bone

Hi guys. I find my kakas are not that fond of cuttlefish. In my early days of keeping these guys i had cuttlefish in my aviaries and at one stage i have 3 out of 5 hens become egg bound. Now it has been over 12 months since kaka-riki put me on to the calcium supplement he mentioned earlier in this topic i have not had a single egg bound bird. Cheers Kev
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Allen
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 12:23 am    Post subject:

Steps, it would be interesting if you could have your natural / organic diet tested as your birds seem to be thriving.

We have facilities over here where you can take in a sample of what you are feeding your birds and have the sample tested. The test report will tell you the vitamin and mineral composition with particular emphasis on what is deficient with recommendations on what to add.

It would be interesting to see what the differences are between your Kiwi diet and the commercial parrot foods available.

You are 100% correct in saying that kakariki are certainly not "normal" parrots in terms of their dietry requirements.
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 6:42 am    Post subject:

Basic diet is here
http://www.kakariki.net/ftopict-12.html
Althu we are also feeding the potato and kumura carrot skins from the kitchen also.
Plus from week to week and season to season we also throw in trimmings from the garden trees and shrubs...mostly native stuff that is in flower and/or has seeded.
Suppliments are given with veggies as a liight sprinkle, 2 to 3 days of racing pidgen mineral/vitiman powder (Kakariki mentioned this some time back) a few small cat biscuits 2 or 3/ bird once or twice a week. Diced cooked Cold lean meat every couple days, espc once the female goes to nest and till young are weaned.
Fruit tends to be what is in season in the gardens...except apples, and kiwi fruit, these are given 2 or 3 times a week.
The birds are rationed (slightly under fed)so that there is no left overs by the next fed (fed 2x a day) Rather than have them more lean than over fed as they do in the wild.

Testing nutrients...not very practical as the diet continually changes week to week and season to season. Also aways trying new stuff. Been thinking a while about trying a bit if chopped raw kidney or heart, liver.

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Allen
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Posts: 269

PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 10:12 pm    Post subject:

Great diet <v>

There is a lot of hype in certain magazines about what not to feed birds and a great deal of the things you are feeding are on the list of what not to feed. I think that most of the articles are written by the formulated food distrubutors so a lot of what they say is probably biased and aimed at marketing their products.

The photos of your birds prove to me that your birds are healthy.
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 11:48 pm    Post subject:

Put simply...would you prefer to feed your children vitimn tables, protien pills, minerial licking blocks, powered eggs and potato, or good old fasihoned food that God intended us (and our birds) to eat?
After yrs of such a synthetic diet can u honestly believe it will not only not harm your children but make them healthier?
Sciientists and their test tubes are now telling us when we are tired have one of those instant energy drinks...pick u up and make you fat then die of heart desease.......what happen to a good old fashioned meal?
Same goes with our birds and 'magic 'formulas' Sure as we cant always source and feed what they would in the wild we need to use some suppliments...and that just what they are, suppliments for those things we cant supply... not the main coarse.
Do zoos feed their lions mac donalds hamburger meat or a side of beef?

For give my cynicism, but I worked as an indusrial chemist for a very large American multi national, we produced household products that the marketing boys and their proganda machines convince the general public the NEEDED couldnt live without, why? because our responsablity was to make a profit for the shareholders.
Baking power will clean glass better than any glass cleaner and the spray from the bottle will not rot your insides out in future yrs.

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