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Kakariki, Care, Breeding, Ecology, and Conservation :: View topic - Buttercup and Lutino
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Buttercup and Lutino

 
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Craig
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:29 pm    Post subject: Buttercup and Lutino

Are they two separate mutations? I have always thought that buttercup is recessive and lutino sex-linked.

I heard of someone who paired two red eyed yellows, and produced a nest of normal coloired chicks. The only way this can happen is if the hen was lutino, and the cock buttercup.

If they are distinct, how can you tell the difference? Is it the appearance of white flight feathers on a buttercup?
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Peter
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Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 599

PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:08 am    Post subject:

Hi Craig,

I'm not sure what you mean with Buttercup. I know of 2 red eyed mutations in Kakariki. The first is the Fallow(see below). This is a recessive mutation. The second one, the non sexe linked Ino or Lutino is still an enigma to me. From breedingresults of another member on this forum I know that both the Lutino and Fallow mutation are located on the same Locus. It means when you pair up a Fallow and a Lutino, all offspring has a intermediate colouring (between that of the parents). So, this Fallow must be called in modern terms 'Bronze Fallow'.

And now starts the confusion. From 2 normal birds I bred these Fallows and Lutinos. This means that both birds must be split to Fallow and split to Lutino. This can not be because in that case both parents must display the intermediate colour mentioned above. Since both parents also produced Cinnamon I have the intention to believe that there must be a second Lutino phenotype caused by the combination of Fallow and Cinnamon.

I know there is a rumour of a sex linked lutino but I have never met one. So I guess it is still a rumour.



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Craig
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:49 am    Post subject:

.a

Last edited by Craig on Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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Craig
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:51 am    Post subject:

An interesting response - thanks.

We have had buttercups (ie. recessive red-eyed yellows) for a number of years. They are definitely recessive due to the way colours are produced. We have always called them buttercup and have bred them with no fallows produced at all.

This year we bred a fallow from a pied hen and a cinnamon pied cock. This pair have also produced buttercups, pieds and cinnamon pieds. We have no idea where it came from, so it certainly makes sense that buttercup and fallow are closely linked.

The birds that I have seen on sale that are described as lutinos always seem to be a brighter yellow than our buttercups, and have yellow, rather than white flight feathers. Might try to get one of these for next year and see what happens.
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Peter
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Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 599

PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:54 am    Post subject:

Craig wrote:
This year we bred a fallow from a pied hen and a cinnamon pied cock. This pair have also produced buttercups, pieds and cinnamon pieds. We have no idea where it came from, so it certainly makes sense that buttercup and fallow are closely linked.

Were those buttercups hens?

Craig wrote:
The birds that I have seen on sale that are described as lutinos always seem to be a brighter yellow than our buttercups, and have yellow, rather than white flight feathers.


The brighter yellow and yellowish flight feathers are due to pied. Pied has a psittacin(yellow,red) increasing characteristic.
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Craig
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:38 pm    Post subject:

Yes the buttercups from this pair have all been hens.

In past years, I'm sure we have produced buttercup cocks from a pair comprising a buttercup cock and a pied hen. But no fallows.
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Peter
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Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 599

PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:04 am    Post subject:

Craig wrote:
Yes the buttercups from this pair have all been hens.



Same situation like mine. Those Buttercups(Lutino) are definitely Cinnamon Fallows. I have the feeling that the true Lutino mutation in Kakariki doesn't excist at all.
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wyndara
Snr Member
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Joined: Jun 19, 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 12:04 am    Post subject:

I totally agree!!!!!!
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Steptoe
Site Admin
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Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 4550

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:40 am    Post subject:

Craig, could u post a pic of the kakariki in your avatar the pic above your name...is that one of your birds...it appears to be a yellow crown rather than a red.

Cheer
Steps

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