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Kakariki, Care, Breeding, Ecology, and Conservation :: View topic - broken beak
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broken beak
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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:24 am    Post subject: broken beak

hi i am new to keeping kakarikis and got a 10 week old one which we hope is a male he realy took to us and my grandsons we have only had him 10 days but he is a joy always wants out and in to everything and goes back in when told the this morning my wife let him out as usual but after 15 mins noticed that his beak had came off and was lying on the floor he had a little blood about his beak i put him back in the cage and phoned a few vets and was given a few different bits of advice ie that it would grow back and another said he could reatatch the beak but it would be expensive and not sure if he would pull through i have spoke to the breeder and he has not heard of this but is trying to find out if anything we could do it would be a shame to lose polly after such a short time any advice please
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:20 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
i have spoke to the breeder and he has not heard of this

We have had over 1000 kakariki and parrots, never heard of a beck falling off, or even ripped off....seen one where the beak was partly broken, split yrs ago , but was still able to eat, grind food. I never foud out how it got on thu.

Parrots fight, hang off and lift heavy stuff , crack nuts, grind up stones and shells, rip hardwoods apart, all with their beak.....Something doesnt add up?????

As to growing back...I do not know, but would not be suprised if it did or how long...BUT in the mean time how does it eat?

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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:53 pm    Post subject:

As I said about beak was a shock to us and we have spoken to dealers the only thing I have been able to find out is maybe been born with a deficient beak or he has damaged it in his cage and when he was out hanging off the curtain it has came off as it only happened yesterday we have been mashing up fruit ind putting vitamins in his water today he is more back to himself as in coming out and into everything I will keep everyone up to date on how Polly gets on
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pabloc
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:29 am    Post subject:

that's very strange, I would also think of a birth defect
ground boiled eggs would also be a good source of soft food

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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:54 am    Post subject:

Hanging off curtains, banging in a cage...no way will that cause something like this....
It would have to be a birth defect...something I have never heard of , but most likely
Or
Someone has riped it off like pulling a persons fingernail out, which I find far more unlikely as there would be far more damage.

Even thu it may grow back, If a defect it would be very likely that this would be an on going issue...which is not acceptable.

I would be going back to the breeder to replace ...
As a breeder I would replace without question and would have done so on 1st veiwing of the bird....
If there where signs of 'fingernail pulling'...which obviously there are not otherwise the vet would have picked that up straight away, kept the bird, and most proberly reported to the local Animal welfare authorities.
I would not replace for fear of a similar incident to the next bird.
If not fingernail pulling,I would also be looking very seriously at that blood line going back several generations trying to find reasons why....be it gentic diet whatever.

From the info posted, it would seem reasonable to most breeders to replace the bird.

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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:52 am    Post subject:

thanks for comment but i know the guy that bred him he is a very honest guy who looks after his birds and who offered to replace the bird and is like us trying to find out what happend also as for anyone deliberatly hurting this bird in my family i find offensive me and my wife have kept all sorts of pets over our 29 years together and have never had problems we would never mistreat an animal and never did with this young bird we have looked at every avenue to save this wee guy and just giving him back to dealer when we have got a bond with the bird i think is wrong if the bird is not eating or starts to show signs or deteriation we will do the humane thing but we think he deserves a chance and we will give him every chance the reason i asked on here is this is a very informative site and thought this might have happened to someone else
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pabloc
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:49 pm    Post subject:

no, it's a very strange situation, I have seen birds with broken beaks after a fight, in fact a neighbor gave me away a couple of years ago 2 budgies with broken beaks, they were broken by an Indian Ringneck.
Also my sister had a budgie that got the beak broken by a lovebird.

But never seen a beak that came off without a violent incident. Even coming off like that is very unlikely, the most likely thing to happen in case of a severe hit is that the beak breaks, not that it comes off.

We didn't mean to say that you mistreated your bird, I think Steps meant that if the vet suspected a violent incident he would have lectured you about it or even call the authorities.

I also understand your position of not wanting to part with the bird. I have the same situation with some birds, for instance I have a cockatiel that was born with only 1 wing (or it was severed while it was very young).

My experience with the budgies that had no upper beak is that they would eat normally, even seed, etc... they died after 2-3 years with me so I guess their death was somehow natural, taking into account their limitations to feed. The only problem with them was that they could not preen themselves so the feather condition was a bit poor.

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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:12 pm    Post subject:

i understand this but the bird we got was only 11 weeks old when we got him it was in an aviary with 5 other kakarikis we have only had him for 1 week we his beak fell of and as for a vet we phoned a number of vets and none would look at him as he was still a baby and they didnt have any experience with kakarikis and we can assure everyone on this sight that their was no foul play we appreciate all comments and the reason we came on to this sight was of the vast experience that the people on this forum has its our first time with a parrot we had to get our dog put down just before christmas we had her 16 years and decided not get another dog we have always wanted a parrot and thats how we got him to let everyone know polly has been eating the soft foods we have been giving him today and has been in and out of cage all day exploring everything and running about on the floor seems to be back to himself will continue to keep you all uptodate on his progress good or bad we hope it will be good news as he is such a character into everything
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Steptoe
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:26 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
We didn't mean to say that you mistreated your bird, I think Steps meant that if the vet suspected a violent incident he would have lectured you about it or even call the authorities.

Exactly....I did not infer or even say that u had mistreated the bird...the opposite, hence my quailfing if u or someone had the vet would have been jumping up and down, and that was not the case...

When mysterious things happen one must consider all possiblies and eliminate each one by one.....

I do have a problem with unintentional mistreating of animals/pets thu.
That is when the house hold cat or dog has got way beyond its yrs, hips gone out, most proberly gut cancer, and cant say "hey Im in constant pain , cant jump off the coach anymore to painful.." and the owners dont have the 'heart' to put the poor animal out of it missery because they "love" the poor thing so much.
Love is a verb not a noun...love is caring looking after, watching out....not a selfish emotion as in "..because I love... " ...Im attached.."

I have never had to deal with a bird with no beak....but its still important to take a honest objective step back, disascoiate ones personal feelings and consider the birds quailty of life.


Quote:
i know the guy that bred him he is a very honest guy who looks after his birds and who offered to replace the bird and is like us trying to find out what happend also

Im glad of that, too often in these and other forums there are a core of breeders and retailers who all they can see in money....
I do strongly suggest that u take up the breeders offer.

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pabloc
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:54 pm    Post subject:

I agree with Steps, if the breeder offers to replace your bird for another youngster, you should consider the offer.

The bird will be properly taken care of, even will have company of other birds, and you will get another bird that will become an excellent pet.
If you keep this one and you get bonded, the most probable thing is that his life expectancy without the beak is not that long, and it hurts when you loose a pet bird.

There's nothing granted, pet birds are prone to accidents and escape, especially kakariki as they are fast and fearless and spend a lot of time on the ground. So it can even happen that a perfectly healthy bird one day has an accident, but his life expectancy at least is longer.
I don't know if you understand what I'm trying to explain here.

On one hand we have to love and respect our pets, on the other hand we also have to be a bit selfish sometimes.

I'm sorry about your dog, they are a different thing to birds, it's not the same relationship, for me it's very sad when a dog dies. I do not own dogs myself, but my girlfriend does and I feel very attached to them. They are very special living beings.
I do not think it's a good decision just because one dog dies not to get another companion dog. Each dog is different. I encourage you to think about it. There's nothing that prevents you from keeping a little parrot and a dog at the same time thumb

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Gee
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:36 am    Post subject:

Hi djwilkie, how are you and the little fellow doing?
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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject:

Hi all just a little update on Polly he is doing very good we have taken lots of advice on this and we now grind up his parrot food and crush up fruit ect he is doing all the normal things kaks do the breeder has been coming round to monitor him and says he is in tiptop condition he is a great wee chap and has started trying to talk saying hello so we will continue to work with him and give him the best life we can
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pabloc
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:27 am    Post subject:

good to hear, excellent job!
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Gee
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:55 am    Post subject:

Glad to hear that!!

maybe you'll find this article interesting:


http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=15+1829&aid=2752


It says that depending upon the species and the type of injury, a bird's beak grows from one to three inches a year.
Acrylics are sometimes used used to repair the beak until new tissue replaces it.

And I was thinking.. I know people can influence the condition their nails and speed up their growth rate by eating food high on vitamine B complex. Bird beaks are in a way simular to our fingernails. Both contain keratin.

all vitamines, minerals etc work together. So I am not suggesting you should use an artificial supplement. However, you could try feeding him natural stuff high on vit B for a while.. to give him just that little extra.

things like: Bananas/asparagus/Broccoli/
Cantaloupe/Endive/guavas/ persimmon/sweet potato/tangerine/kidney beans/adzuki beans/ etc...

And a question.. silly maybe... but a tongue is kept moist in a mouth or a beak. Does not his tongue risk drying out now his beak is not complete anymore?
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djwilkie
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:33 am    Post subject:

Thanks we will try more vit b as for his tongue it is not exposed and his bottom beak and what he left of top beak seems to hide it
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